Public Sector Jobsworths

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by jonny » Wed Nov 23, 2011 11:40 pm

My ex works for the UK Border agency and hasn't had a pay rise in years, in fact they are looking to get rid of people, where she works they are understaffed and overworked (maybe that's why she can be a cranky cow at times :lol: ) it's the top brass though who still hold all the aces and they haven't suffered like people on the lower end of the pay spectrum, of course there are some people milking it for all it's worth but tha isn't just confined to the public sector.

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by dj jedi » Thu Nov 24, 2011 12:38 pm

Nice headline:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-15871340

I love the way these people think they're entitled to these things. If any normal person is unhappy with their package, they discuss it with their boss, and if they can't reach an agreement look for/get another job. As I have just done recently.

If they're so useless they don't think they can get another job, maybe they should stop complaining about the cushty one they do have.

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by Double Drop » Thu Nov 24, 2011 6:05 pm

dj jedi wrote:Nice headline:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-15871340

I love the way these people think they're entitled to these things. If any normal person is unhappy with their package, they discuss it with their boss, and if they can't reach an agreement look for/get another job. As I have just done recently.

If they're so useless they don't think they can get another job, maybe they should stop complaining about the cushty one they do have.
We are entitled to them, it was in our contracts when we joined the service.

All we want is what we signed up for, we don't want anything new or extra.

I've worked for over nineteen-years in the Ministry of Defence and worked my way up from the bottom. When I joined I was promised a pension, the last twenty-years I've worked towards that. I've contributed throughout my career and received smaller pay rises during that time knowing that the 18% pay abatement was in return for a good deal at the end and job security.

For twelve-years now I've received less than inflation in my annual pay deal; even during the "good times". What have the deals been like in the private sector?

I've had my pension made "fair and sustainable" by Labour five or six years ago.

Then I've had the calculations changed from RPI to CPI to screw me out of cash that I've already earned.

Now they want me to pay more to receive less, later?

Enough is enough.

Oh, and don't you think it's a bit coincidental all these anti-CS stories hitting the press the week before a strike?

You see Danny Alexander? You love him, you do.

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by tdo » Thu Nov 24, 2011 9:19 pm

Double Drop wrote:
dj jedi wrote:Nice headline:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-15871340

I love the way these people think they're entitled to these things. If any normal person is unhappy with their package, they discuss it with their boss, and if they can't reach an agreement look for/get another job. As I have just done recently.

If they're so useless they don't think they can get another job, maybe they should stop complaining about the cushty one they do have.
We are entitled to them, it was in our contracts when we joined the service.

All we want is what we signed up for, we don't want anything new or extra.

I've worked for over nineteen-years in the Ministry of Defence and worked my way up from the bottom. When I joined I was promised a pension, the last twenty-years I've worked towards that. I've contributed throughout my career and received smaller pay rises during that time knowing that the 18% pay abatement was in return for a good deal at the end and job security.

For twelve-years now I've received less than inflation in my annual pay deal; even during the "good times". What have the deals been like in the private sector?

I've had my pension made "fair and sustainable" by Labour five or six years ago.

Then I've had the calculations changed from RPI to CPI to screw me out of cash that I've already earned.

Now they want me to pay more to receive less, later?

Enough is enough.

Oh, and don't you think it's a bit coincidental all these anti-CS stories hitting the press the week before a strike?

You see Danny Alexander? You love him, you do.

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Don't like it? Then get another job.

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by champion puffa » Thu Nov 24, 2011 11:50 pm

dj jedi wrote:
If they're so useless they don't think they can get another job, maybe they should stop complaining about the cushty one they do have.
Thats the public sector for you. I and many others have seen and noted the masses of ex public sector workers that thought they would jump to the better paid private sector..... only to be sacked due to not working as hard or willing to do overtime for free or make other sacrifices the rest of the private sector workers make to keep their job.
Double Drop wrote:We are entitled to them, it was in our contracts when we joined the service.

All we want is what we signed up for, we don't want anything new or extra.

I've worked for over nineteen-years in the Ministry of Defence and worked my way up from the bottom. When I joined I was promised a pension, the last twenty-years I've worked towards that. I've contributed throughout my career and received smaller pay rises during that time knowing that the 18% pay abatement was in return for a good deal at the end and job security.

For twelve-years now I've received less than inflation in my annual pay deal; even during the "good times". What have the deals been like in the private sector?

I've had my pension made "fair and sustainable" by Labour five or six years ago.

Then I've had the calculations changed from RPI to CPI to screw me out of cash that I've already earned.

Now they want me to pay more to receive less, later?

WELCOME TO THE BRITISH FORCES AND THE REAL BRITISH WORK FORCE MATE!!!!
About time you civvys and tax payer funded workers took it up the arse too!!!
tdo wrote:Don't like it? Then get another job.
:lol: yeah and good luck finding any kind of job today that lasts for more than 2 months.

the main fact is........ Public sector work makes £0 for the economey.
Let them strike and sack the lot of them........... im sure there are 100s of 1000s of Eastern European and African / Asian people that will gladly take their jobs for 1/4 of the wages just to live in such a multicultural, daisy chain making country.... We love MRSA in our hospitals though ;)
:lol:

its all well and good striking ....... IF there is not 10000s of imigrents in the contry willing to do the job 1/2 as well for 1/4 of the wage...... WELCOME TO ENGLAND

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by The_Ruffneck » Fri Nov 25, 2011 9:01 am

50% of public sector needs to be sacked

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by Beagle » Fri Nov 25, 2011 10:33 am

I can see both sides to this argument, and I do believe that those in the public sector think us private sector workers have better deals etc. This is not always true (for example, I work for a company whose policy is to not give any pay rises unless someone either asks, or hands in their notice. Neither guarantees success!)
And if I want a pension I have to sort it out myself.

However, I will back Double Drop up on one point. Which is this:
Double Drop wrote: We are entitled to them, it was in our contracts when we joined the service.
All we want is what we signed up for, we don't want anything new or extra.
The fact remains that if it was in their contracts then nothing should change. In the private sector, if we have contracts of employment an employer cannot change the details of that contract without both parties agreeing to it. We are protected by employment law on this.
It seems that those in the public sector ARE having their contracts altered as, ultimately, their employer is the government.

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by dj jedi » Fri Nov 25, 2011 10:39 am

Double Drop wrote: We are entitled to them, it was in our contracts when we joined the service.

All we want is what we signed up for, we don't want anything new or extra.
But things change mate. Yes you and many other public sector workers may have agreed to a pension 5, 10, 20 years ago, when it was expected you'd work til 65 and then live til 75. But the government has a very good point - why should they pay for you to live for 40 years after you've stopped working for them? Whay should you contribute 5k a year for 40 years, and then get paid 20k a year for the same amount of time? People are living dramatically longer now then when pensions were brought in. It is not sustainable - end of story. I don't intend to stop working the second I'm 65, in fact I'm pretty damn sure I won't be able to afford to! But I'm going to try to prepare for that situation, not make everyone else's life a misery by striking.

The other thing is, IMO there's no such thing as a job for life any more. I've been screwed over in the past (in my opinion) too, I was promised a decent end of year bonus at my last company which didn't materialise - so I left. That's what you and anybody else that's upnhappy should do. If the wages are so shit, look for another job! It's the fastest way to increase your salary, another fact of life.

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by Double Drop » Fri Nov 25, 2011 4:52 pm

Beagle wrote:However, I will back Double Drop up on one point. Which is this:
Double Drop wrote: We are entitled to them, it was in our contracts when we joined the service.
All we want is what we signed up for, we don't want anything new or extra.
The fact remains that if it was in their contracts then nothing should change. In the private sector, if we have contracts of employment an employer cannot change the details of that contract without both parties agreeing to it. We are protected by employment law on this.
It seems that those in the public sector ARE having their contracts altered as, ultimately, their employer is the government.
Thank you. That's the issue here.

I don't want to get another job, if there were jobs available. I like my job, I like knowing that what I'm doing is making a difference to the front line.

We're not all desk polishing sickie-pullers, no matter what the media would have you believe.

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by DJ Chance » Fri Nov 25, 2011 6:46 pm

I work in the private sector for a large bank and all our pensions were changed. No more final salary, have to contribute etc.. Nobody striked, people were a bit pee'd off but got on with it as the world has changed. It was in effect a 6-7% pay cut straight away when final salary was taken away and everyone had to start to contribute.

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by dj jedi » Sun Nov 27, 2011 6:49 pm

Double Drop wrote:
Double Drop wrote: We are entitled to them, it was in our contracts when we joined the service.
All we want is what we signed up for, we don't want anything new or extra.
Thank you. That's the issue here.
Understandable, but surely you can see why the changes are necessary. Where do you think the money is going to come from to pay your 40 year retirement? Private sector tax money, that's where!

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by Beagle » Sun Nov 27, 2011 7:00 pm

dj jedi wrote: Understandable, but surely you can see why the changes are necessary. Where do you think the money is going to come from to pay your 40 year retirement? Private sector tax money, that's where!
40 year retirement? Given that the average life-expectancy is 78, I'd say he's looking at a 10-15 year retirement.

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by Double Drop » Sun Nov 27, 2011 7:47 pm

Beagle wrote:
dj jedi wrote: Understandable, but surely you can see why the changes are necessary. Where do you think the money is going to come from to pay your 40 year retirement? Private sector tax money, that's where!
40 year retirement? Given that the average life-expectancy is 78, I'd say he's looking at a 10-15 year retirement.
Retirement age will already be 68 by the time I come to retire, if not higher.

I've already realised that I'm going to die before I get to retire.

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by dj jedi » Mon Nov 28, 2011 10:39 am

Beagle wrote: 40 year retirement? Given that the average life-expectancy is 78, I'd say he's looking at a 10-15 year retirement.
That's now, I'm pretty sure it's more like 90 for our generation. The fact is that when pensions were introduced, most people only lived for 10 years or so after they retired. Which makes economical sense - work for 40 years, stash away 5-10k a year, and then have a comfortable last 10 years. That same amount of contributed money will NOT last much longer than that. Hence the uproar.

DD - completely agree! I have no intention of shrivelling up til I'm 90+ after seeing what happened to my Grandparents, looked like living hell.

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Re: Public Sector Jobsworths

Post by Double Drop » Mon Nov 28, 2011 6:36 pm

dj jedi wrote:
Double Drop wrote:
Double Drop wrote: We are entitled to them, it was in our contracts when we joined the service.
All we want is what we signed up for, we don't want anything new or extra.
Thank you. That's the issue here.
Understandable, but surely you can see why the changes are necessary. Where do you think the money is going to come from to pay your 40 year retirement? Private sector tax money, that's where!
But Labour already tackled our pensions five-years ago and as a result the proportion of pensions to GDP is already falling.

http://www.parliament.uk/business/commi ... ns-report/


From 26 May 2011:
Government projections of the future cost of public service pensions suggest that the changes made in 2007-2008 will stabilise costs at around 1% of GDP, thereby bringing substantial savings to the taxpayer. This would be a significant achievement.

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