Reaching a wider audience

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dj jedi
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Reaching a wider audience

Post by dj jedi » Thu Oct 17, 2013 12:01 pm

All this talk about the excellent new Manix album has got me thinking. The picture disc (300 copies) sold out very quickly, and the black vinyl is also now sold out (500 copies I believe.) So that's 800 copies of a brand new, not sought after/expensive hardcore EP. Granted it's by Manix and on Reinforced, but surely there must be more to it than that?

I know from my own releases in recent years and from what other label owners have said that selling even 100 copies of a record via the usual channels is difficult now, so how have they managed to sell hundreds of copies direct without distro?

That is obviously the way forward as it cuts out the middle man and makes releases such as this affordable - there's no way a 300 run picture disc would be £15 if sold through distributors/shops, but if selling direct you could dare I say even make a decent profit!

So, where have these 700+ extra buyers come from? They obviously love vinyl and old skool, so why is nobody else able to shift these kind of numbers for either new 'hardcore breaks' (which is what this release is) or old rare/sought after records like the Sublogic releases?

I'm quite excited by this personally as it could potentially open the gates for more (and importantly larger volume) releases, and more old producers to return (Jack Smooth!?) We just need to show them that the market is there.

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Re: Reaching a wider audience

Post by dj_gyr8 » Thu Oct 17, 2013 12:17 pm

Hi,

The main reason this sold out 800 units is simply because it is on REINFORCED. Also, it is by MANIX, who were one of the best selling artists on Reinforced BITD.

This release was visible on many forums, boards, FB etc.

The reason the B2VOS stuff doesn't sell aswell is simple: our stuff aint advertised!

Another thing - those 800 vinyls will NOT be played on a turntable!

There is a MASSIVE thing going on with NEW vinyl right now - mainly ALBUMS only!

People specifically buy these limited album releases, and then advertise them for sale, as they sell out and the value shoots up!

You guys wouldn't believe how this concept of limited run albums has taken off - its like a new trend or something! Artist and genre is irrelevant - even Disney albums go for £100+ due to this new phenomenon!

Our mistake - we're just trying to get new music out there for DJs to play

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Re: Reaching a wider audience

Post by oldskoolvibe.com » Thu Oct 17, 2013 12:26 pm

The way I see it is this...basically you’ve got an original artist who released some cracking choons back in the day who has made a big effort in putting out a great new album that is new to our ears but in the original hardcore style. No disrespect to anyone who has produced or repressed hardcore recently but a lot of it is for us the “train spotters” and not always the wider audience. Quite often the new releases I see have only happened because of hard work from someone else working with the original artist to release a rare track or previously unreleased choon. I’m fairly sure that any original artist who still has the enthusiasm and willing to rekindle the old sound could easily sell 500 to 1000 units if the quality is right, however if too many jump on the bandwagon sales would probably drop. 

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Re: Reaching a wider audience

Post by The_Ruffneck » Thu Oct 17, 2013 12:39 pm

https://www.facebook.com/reinforced
Good advertising on facebook is my guess, word of mouth spreading fast on there etc.Facebook seems the key these days.

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Re: Reaching a wider audience

Post by Traffic Cone » Thu Oct 17, 2013 1:36 pm

i think who it is, and the whole limited edition package thing is a big part of why it has sold. but i do think there's maybe also more potential for it now than a few years ago.

does seem that there's been a steady increase in 90s influences in dance music in general in the last few years. seems to be more interest in jungle too, for instance. i don't follow popular new music enough to say this with confidence, but i've heard the odd popular new tune with a bit of an old influence. i mean i know people have been making 90s style tunes for ages but i think it is slowly catching on - surely it's inevitable given how popular culture works? maybe hardcore breaks was too ahead of its time, ironically :D

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Re: Reaching a wider audience

Post by lemsip » Thu Oct 17, 2013 2:07 pm

It had clever marketing too. I chose not to order one several weeks ago, but when I saw they were sold out, but there were mini releases for a few days, I jumped on it. Obviously there has to be demand for that kind of marketing to work.

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Re: Reaching a wider audience

Post by rage » Thu Oct 17, 2013 2:23 pm

Agree with everyone else! Great product + clever marketing + renowned producer + limited edition = Hype!

They have done a superb job, I'm sure it has been more popular than even they were anticipating though. Now is definitely the time for old skool producers to be making a comeback, it's all coming back around. Sir Jack now is your time, get that box set ready! ;)

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Re: Reaching a wider audience

Post by nebkins » Thu Oct 17, 2013 3:26 pm

Id say probably a lot of the people who bought the picture disc bought more than one copy.

Im happy with the black vinyl.

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Re: Reaching a wider audience

Post by Ric » Thu Oct 17, 2013 3:30 pm

Agree with the above comments really. It's all good news though as it might bring a few more legends out of the woodwork.
Step up Acen. :grin:

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Re: Reaching a wider audience

Post by RonWellsJS » Thu Oct 17, 2013 3:52 pm

The only way to look at this now is ltd edition art. The same as doing a small run of high quality prints (Banksy, etc).

I've already spoken about this with people on here and a couple of weeks ago I mentioned it to Phantasy who was quite receptive to the idea. The potential problem with it is, this will probably be a fad that lasts for max 2-3 releases for each artist and then it will be over for ever and the artist labeled as a 'money grabber'.

The idea does appeal but I'm choosing between being paid more money than I ever made out of music to design a peice of software than doing something like this, so you can appreciate why I haven't dived in yet.

I'd be interested to learn what a 10 track vinyl LP with brochure booklet, accompanying CD version, HAND signed EVERY copy and serial numbered pack ought to sell for?

* Price if only 100 are made?
* Price if only 250 are made?
* Price if only 500 are made?

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Re: Reaching a wider audience

Post by rage » Thu Oct 17, 2013 4:28 pm

If you are looking at a full LP, rather than a single 12 I think you would need to look at releasing it as a DJ friendly 8 track LP over two records, as anything over 2 tracks per side is a real turn off for DJs. Even 3 per side takes all the strength out of the sound when mixed with other records. An LP released over 2 seperate 12" could work well, would make a nice collectable if the artwork joined up and probably a bit more money as you know everyone would buy both parts!

I don't think you would be accused of selling out as long as the tunes are good, people will always respect good music! I for one would jump at a chance to buy a copy as I'm sure everyone else on here would. Would be amazing if you could reignite some of the old partnerships, Wax Doctor, Phantasy, Earl Grey etc. to put in there alongside solo stuff too.

It won't make as much money as your software project but maybe ultimately more satisfying! :D I guess it all comes down to whether you feel the desire to do it, if not then there's really no point. It's easy for me to sit here egging you on but I'm not the one who's got to make the music. If you need a studio hand though...

Sorry Jedi I've gone way off topic here!

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Re: Reaching a wider audience

Post by Ric » Thu Oct 17, 2013 6:09 pm

I wouldn't say people would get labelled money grabbers. As Rage said, if the tunes are good...
Nobody would care if you're making a quick earner! And why shouldn't you.
We get tunes you get money. I'm fine with that :)

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Re: Reaching a wider audience

Post by renegadegenius » Thu Oct 17, 2013 6:57 pm

Think a lot of it is as people have mentioned - it's by Manix & it's on Reinforced.

I did buy a copy, but only think 4 of the tunes are alright & even they are nothing compared to the ones that Manix did back in the day.

I recon if this had come out under another name it wouldn't have sold anywhere near as well - would you have even bothered to click on the link to listen?

Example - http://www.divshare.com/download/24658209-c44
Not a big name/label release, but imo some quality hardcore tunes - did it sell... hardly any which is a big shame.

Manix / Reinforced have a large following hence the interest.
But will these tunes still be played in years to come like their earlier classics... ?

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Re: Reaching a wider audience

Post by dj jedi » Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:59 pm

That's exactly what I mean - don't get my wrong I love the new Manix EP, but it's not like there haven't been releases by equally big producers and labels in recent years, and they haven't sold nearly as well. It must be down to the marketing, which is what I'm trying to figure out.

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Re: Reaching a wider audience

Post by rage » Thu Oct 17, 2013 9:33 pm

Elusive9T2 wrote:It is all down to hype IMO, nothing more
If people think they are gonna miss out they show a sudden interest
No matter how good the tunes are
They fueled the hype by letting them out in dribs & drabs on the site, it worked
That is true, but when you look at what we got for our money, a lovely looking limited pic disc made in the Enforcers style, a 10 track CD, digital download and keyring to boot all delivered to our doors for 12.50 that is pretty awesome value for money! It's hardly surprising it flew off the shelves. They definitely fueled the hype, but I doubt anyone has been left feeling short changed!

I have to disagree about the quality of music RG, what stood out for me is that I don't think I've heard new Hardcore sound quite this authentic up til now, he has captured that 93 vibe brilliantly. Maybe the tunes aren't stand out anthems, but then neither were a lot of the tunes found on Reinforced 12s back then! His use of breakbeats is sublime, lovely little touches all over the place without over engineering things. The only niggle I would make is that the No Good vocal sounds a little out of tune with the rest of the track to my ears.

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